Comparative Religion

Comparative Religion – Part 7 ‘Quick Review’

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Seventh Night
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‘Quick Review’

 

Comparative Religion – Using google translate for translation from Indonesia to English, and, we Ready for edit our content if we there is miss translation. but for the verses, we use New International Version. don’t worry.

Comparative Religion – Seventh Night

BM : After I explained to you about the verses of the Qur’an that explained the process of origin of human events that you asked about the verses last night, was there a conflict?

Did the Prophet Muhammad have the mistake of conveying as you first thought?
AW : Nothing, you have explained in terms of Scientific that I should honestly believe it.

BM : So the Prophet Muhammad is correct, it is not wrong to convey it.
AW : Not mistaken, actually true.

BM : So you admit that the Prophet Muhammad was right as an Apostle of Allah.
AW : I admit, because he was right.

BM : Thank you, brothers and sisters who witnessed Antonius’s own acknowledgment of the Prophet Muhammad’s Messenger, without coercion, but with his own awareness after the discussion.

Do you really recognize the apostleship of the Prophet Muhammad and acknowledge the Prophet Muhammad was a messenger of God.
AW : Yes, with God’s witness, I admit it.

BM : Alhamdulillah, brother Antonius is already 50% Muslim.

I say 50% of Islam because it only understands and believes in the apostleship of the Prophet Muhammad, so there is still 50% left, because you have not convinced the Essence of God Almighty.
AW : Yes, that’s right.

My belief in the Trinity (God the Father, God the Son and the Holy Spirit) has not disappeared at all, even though you have explained the Bible that I cannot refute.

However, with your statements began to doubt the Trinity.

Even so, are you still willing to provide information (reasons) in the Bible that says that Jesus is not God.

BM : Actually, at our first meeting I mentioned based on the Gospels themselves that Jesus is not God as you have examined yourself in Matthew chapter 1 verse 16; Mark chapter 13 verse 32;

Deuteronomy article 4 paragraph 33;

Deuteronomy article 6, paragraph 4;

Mark chapter 12 verse 29. All of that we have read.

But in order to fulfill your expectations to be more convincing, I continue again.

Please read Luke chapter 4 verses 1 and 2.
AW : Alright, it says here:

Luke 4:1-2 New International Version (NIV)
Jesus Is Tested in the Wilderness
4 Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, left the Jordan and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness,

2 where for forty days he was tempted by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry.

BM : 1. In this verse it says that the Holy Spirit took Jesus to the wilderness.

If Jesus is a god, it is impossible for anyone to carry it.
2. In this verse it says that Jesus was tempted by Satan.

No wonder God was tempted by Satan or the face of Satan daring to tempt God.

3. Even in this verse there is mention that Jesus felt hungry.

Is it natural that God is hungry?
Then the attributes of Jesus are the same as those of ordinary human beings; can be brought, can be tempted by the devil and feel hungry.

Review Matthew chapter 4 verse 5.
AW : Well, it says:

New International Version
Then the devil took him to the holy city and had him stand on the highest point of the temple.

BM : In this verse there is mention that Jesus was taken by Satan.

No wonder God was taken by Devil.

God’s character is subject to the will of Devil so that it is carried everywhere, somewhere. deserves the devil so brave to god?.

Review Matthew chapter 27 verses 1 and 2.
AW : Well, it says:

Matthew 27:1-2 New International Version (NIV)
Judas Hangs Himself
27 Early in the morning, all the chief priests and the elders of the people made their plans how to have Jesus executed.

2 So they bound him, led him away and handed him over to Pilate the governor.

BM : In this verse it says that Jesus was bound; deserves God can be bound by humans.

Then where is the power of God, so willingly surrender himself to humans? Review Luke chapter 2 verse 21 again.
AW : Well, it says:

Luke 2:21 New International Version (NIV)
21 On the eighth day, when it was time to circumcise the child, he was named Jesus, the name the angel had given him before he was conceived.

BM : Is it natural for God to be circumcised? Is it necessary for God to be circumcised?
AW : Is there a firmer statement that Jesus really is a human child not a child of God ?

BM : Please open Matthew chapter 26 verse 2.
AW : Well, it says that:

Matthew 26:2 New International Version (NIV)
2 “As you know, the Passover is two days away—and the Son of Man will be handed over to be crucified.”

BM : What is meant by the son of man is Jesus.

So it is clear that Jesus is not a child of God, but a son of man.

Please check in Matthew chapter 5 verse 45.
AW : Well, it says that:

Matthew 5:45 New International Version (NIV)
45 that you may be children of your Father in heaven.

He causes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.

BM : It says here that those who obey God, according to Jesus, will become God’s children.

So I am not saying that Jesus is not the only begotten of God, but the children of God will increase in number again, based on the Bible itself in Matthew chapter 5 verse 45 that we read earlier is: “that you may be children of your Father in heaven. … “Please open Matthew chapter 7 verse 21.
AW : It says:

Matthew 7:21 New International Version (NIV)
True and False Disciples
21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

BM : In the Bible itself, it is clear that Jesus denied even rejecting the person who called out: “Lord, Lord” to him, that person cannot enter the kingdom of heaven.

Are there not enough evidences that I have shown you?
AW : Enough is enough. Thank you; but if it still exists, I ask, for my satisfaction

BM : Ask what else do you mean.
AW : What says in the Gospels that Jesus is a human child “not a child of God.”

BM : Alright, I will fulfill your hope, please check in Matthew chapter 16 verse 27.
AW : In this chapter and verse it says:

Matthew 16:27 New International Version (NIV)
27 For the Son of Man is going to come in his Father’s glory with his angels, and then he will reward each person according to what they have done.

BM : In this verse there is mention of the son of man, according to your interpretation, who is meant by the son of man in this verse.
AW : Yes, of course Jesus.

BM : So in the Gospels themselves there is a mention that Jesus is “the son of man”; not a child of God, right or not.
AW : Yes, that’s right.

BM : Now, if that’s true, why did you mention Jesus is a child of God?
AW : Jesus is God but likened to humans.

BM : If Jesus is God, why was he begotten by humans (Mary).

Jesus was human because he was begotten by humans (Mary).

It’s too strange for humans (Mary) to beget God.

Can science be born as well as inner knowledge (Spirituality) accept that there is a God begotten by humans? Can exact or abstract science (Exact abstract) accept it?
AW : Yes, indeed it is impossible for God to be begotten by humans.

BM : Not only that, but in the Gospels Jesus himself said that he was not a child of God, but God’s Messenger.

As I showed the verse at our last meeting.
AW : That’s right, you mentioned.

But I ask for the verse to be repeated, because I have somewhat forgotten the arrangement.

BM : Please check on John chapter 5 verse 30.
AW : In this chapter and verse it states:

John 5:30 New International Version (NIV)
30 By myself I can do nothing; I judge only as I hear, and my judgment is just, for I seek not to please myself but him who sent me.

BM : This verse is very clear, clearly showing that Jesus himself claimed that he was not God, but the messenger of God.

In this verse Jesus tells us that he does not act according to God’s will, so God’s character cannot do as he pleases, and is it appropriate for God to be sent (sent) to be a messenger.
AW : Yes, I confess; Jesus himself claimed not to be a child of God.

BM : For your satisfaction, please check again in John, chapter 3, verse 13.
AW : Alright, in this chapter and verse it states:

John 3:13 New International Version (NIV)
13 No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man.

BM : Based on the Biblical verses that I showed and your own brother who examined and read them, then once again I asked: “Is that human child of Jesus or son of God” ?.
AW : Yes, based on these verses I said: “Jesus is a son of man.”

BM : In the verse you read but, Matthew chapter 16 verse 27, in addition to mentioning that Jesus is a human child, also states that he will repay each person according to his actions.

Is that right? please check again.
AW : Yes, that’s right in that verse there is a mention.

BM : According to the composition of the verse, it is clear: “Refuse the inheritance sin,” based on that verse, each person will be rewarded according to their own actions, so there is no penance.
AW : Yes, we have talked about inheritance sins and indeed I have admitted “there is no inheritance sin.”

BM : Right, we talked about it, I just add it up, to further strengthen the previous statement.
AW : It’s quite clear from your statement.

BM : Clearly how?
AW : Based on the Scriptures themselves that Jesus is not a child of God but a son of man.

And based on the Gospels says that Jesus himself acknowledged he was not a child of God, but “messenger (Messenger) of God”

BM : Thank God, then. So what is your current belief in the “Trinity” (God the Father, God the Son and the Holy Spirit).
AW : Naturally my belief in the Trinity was erased.

BM : Alhamdulillah, so you admit that God is one.
AW : Before that I want to ask a question.

BM : Alright, but you have admitted at the last meeting and those who were present also witnessed that:
First, you have justified the Qur’an.

Some of the verses of the Qur’an that you put forward that at first you considered to be in conflict between one verse with another, after I explained and interpreted it, then you admit that the verses are essentially no dispute between the one with the other.

Isn’t that your confession.
AW : Yes, that’s right.

BM : Secondly, at the last meeting you have recognized the truth of the prophet Muhammad SAW as the Messenger of God, is that right?
AW : Yes, that’s right I admit it.

BM : Third, you have confirmed that the verses in the Gospels (the Bible) have several verses that are in conflict with one another.

As I showed the verses at the previous meeting, is that true of your confession.
AW : Yes, I admit.

However, I still need other evidence about the Gospel verses that there is a dispute between one another, for the sake of satisfaction for me, even though your statement is quite satisfying.

But maybe there are more verses to absorb it into my feelings.

BM : Alright, I fulfill your expectation, please check the book of Yahya chapter 8 verse 14.

AW : Well, the article and this verse says:

John 8:14 New International Version (NIV)
14 Jesus answered, “Even if I testify on my own behalf, my testimony is valid, for I know where I came from and where I am going. But you have no idea where I come from or where I am going.

BM : Please check again John 5 verse 31.
AW : Alright, in this chapter and verse it states:

John 5:31 New International Version (NIV)
Testimonies About Jesus
31 “If I testify about myself, my testimony is not true.

BM : Well, you prove the dispute in these two verses yourself.

In one verse it says: “My testimony is valid,” while in another verse it says “My testimony is not true.”

The two verses that are at odds, are in the scriptures.

And the one talking is a person. Which is true between these two verses. The face of the scriptures contains verses that contradict each other.
AW : Yes, I admit it is not suitable.

BM : Not only is it not suitable, but it is a striking difference.
AW : But maybe one of those verses was a typo.

BM : If it was a typo, of course there were errors; but there is nothing mentioned in this book.
AW : This in Indonesian Bible, excuse me for a moment, I will check the Bible in English.

BM : That’s better, will I check or you?
AW : Because you have memorized many verses of the Bible, I submit it so that you can examine it, so that it is faster.

BM : Alright; hope you also pay attention to those present, the book that I hold is the English Bible, “The Holy Bible,” “Containing the Old and New Testaments (American Bible Society).” I submit this book to brother Antonius and I will shows the chapter and verse to be examined together.
AW : Fine, I accept the Bible in English.

BM : Please check with John chapter 8 verse 14 on page 104.
AW : Alright, on page 104 of the book of John chapter 8 verse 14 here it says:

John 8:14 New International Version (NIV)
14 Jesus answered, “Even if I testify on my own behalf, my testimony is valid, for I know where I came from and where I am going. But you have no idea where I come from or where I am going.

BM : If we copy this verse into Indonesian, it is this: “If I witness from my own point of view, that is also my testimony.” Is that really true?
AW : Yes, that’s right.

BM : So it’s the same as the Indonesian-language gospel in John chapter 8 verse 14, hope you match it first.
AW : Right, the meaning is as strong

BM : Now please check in John chapter 5 verse 31.
AW : Here it says:

John 5:31 New International Version (NIV)
Testimonies About Jesus
31 “If I testify about myself, my testimony is not true.

BM : This verse, if we copy it into Indonesian, would be like this: “If I witness from my case, then my testimony is not true.” Is that right?
AW : Yes, right

BM : Please check more carefully in this English-language Bible. In one verse mentioning “IS VALID,” is true, while in another verse mentioning “IS NOT TRUE,” is incorrect.
AW : Yes, it is different

BM : If so, in the Indonesian and English gospels there are no different meanings and meanings?
AW : That’s right.

BM : So it is not a typo, the one that is wrong is filling the scriptures.

If it is true that the scriptures (the Gospels) are revelations from God, it is impossible that the verses will disagree with one another.

So the book has been interfered with by human hands.
AW : In my opinion, the two verses are not contradictory, maybe one verse was revoked, then replaced with another verse.

Clearly, one deleted verse is replaced by another (new) verse.

As far as I know in the verses of the Qur’an there is what is called “Nasich and Mansuch” is one verse erased the law, then replaced with another verse (new law).

But with regard to the two verses in the Bible earlier, I am of the opinion not contradictory, but one verse was replaced with another verse, so that there seems to be an opposite.

May I give an example.

BM : Please, you have the right to fully speak with me in our meeting.
AW : I mentioned for example: Issued a rule, every cyclist at night is required to use lights.

Then come again the rules may not use lights, because there is war for example.

Here are two rules, the first: “Required to use lights.” While the second “Forbidden.”

The two orders, which are used are the later.

Likewise, the two verses in the Bible are not contradictory, but one of them is no longer valid (revoked). This is in my opinion.

BM : Alright, but of course you understand, if a regulation is changed, it should be followed by an explanation, that the article number is so many verses, so many years is revoked, it is replaced by the article number so and so on.

However, the two verses in the Bible, there is no mention of one verse that is replaced, in other words the two verses remain contradictory to one another. There is no explanation that one has been revoked, or replaced.
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Read also

Clear Contradiction in Bible?

Comparative Religion – Part 6 ‘Error in the Quran?’

Comparative Religion – Part 8 Contradiction Verses

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